Review of “The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill” Podcast: The Incarnation and the Carnage

Lydia Kulina
4 min readSep 1, 2021
“Contrary to the title, the culture of Mars Hill and Driscoll has not been dismantled. We would be remiss in only exploring the long-existing macro-issues of the church, charismatic leaders, power issues, and spiritual abuse, through a re-telling of Mars Hill’s narrative.”

“There is a pile of dead bodies behind the Mars Hill bus, and by God’s grace, it’ll be a mountain by the time we’re done,” the charismatic Seattle pastor once declared at a pastoral conference. “You either get on the bus or you get run over by the bus.” Years later that metaphorical bus would be retired to the bus depot for mechanical errors, including faulty brakes and a locked steering wheel. Recently, I stumbled upon the new podcast from Christianity Today “The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill”. In the ongoing series, host Mike Cosper explores the forces that lead to the creation and decline of the megachurch and its influential leader Mark Driscoll. It is “the story of one church, who grew from a handful of people to a movement — and then collapsed almost overnight. It’s a story about power, fame, and spiritual trauma.” With Serial-quality production and deep investigation, the podcast has become the ecclesiological talking point of the season. While the accusations against Driscoll are not a surprise, having been extensively covered in major media outlets, it is the first time that many former church leaders are publicly speaking out. While the podcast tries to make the point that Mars Hill was the culmination of “problems faced across the spectrum of churches in America”, it misses the point that the culture that Driscoll created still prevails because of the influence he had over a generation of leaders, pastors, and church planters. Amidst the carnage of the church hurt, the culture of Mars Hills has been reincarnated in ministries that continue to engage in the same practices.

For years, I attended a church led by a pastor who was closely mentored by Driscoll. I grappled with many of the themes that oft-defined Mars Hill — misogyny, patriarchy, and toxic masculinity. As a woman, my positionality was as the podcast describes “a means to an end”. This feeling was reinforced in the male ministry emphasis and constant, tangential reminders from sermons. Returning from our honeymoon when I was 21, I was publicly directed to “go make babies” from the pulpit (in case you’re wondering, I only have a goldendoodle). It would be the second step in the litany of expectations for women to validate and actualize their husband’s manhood. Like young women at Mars Hill, I would repeatedly be told to leave my career and become a stay-at-home mother. Other issues that will remain intentionally undetailed in this re-telling prevailed as well. When I spoke up about these concerns in a meeting with the pastors, my husband and I would be shamed from the pulpit, cut off from our community, and accused of slander. We got ran over by the bus.

I don’t want to belabor my story — I still fear the local repercussions of speaking up and do not want to break the scabs of wounds that have slowly healed with prayer, time, and (expensive) counseling. Yes, the podcast is correct that these are issues that characterize countless churches across the nation, not just Mars Hill. I know the pain intimately well — the pain of losing your community, the pain of shame, the pain of lost faith. Nevertheless, while trying to situate the story of the mega-church and its fallen leader in the contemporary Evangelical ethos, the podcast errs in overlooking the lasting cultural legacy of Driscoll.

Contrary to the title, the culture of Mars Hill and Driscoll has not been dismantled. We would be remiss in only exploring the long-existing macro-issues of the church, charismatic leaders, power issues, and spiritual abuse, through a re-telling of Mars Hill’s narrative. These have existed since the beginning of the church. Cosper states that he hopes the story-telling will “cultivate a better moral imagination… [so we can] ask better questions…” However, for listeners who had have lived in the shadow of Driscoll’s influence, they don’t need much of an imagination. The values, leadership style, and culture have not just disappeared from congregations, marriages, and personalities when Driscoll abandoned his congregation. Let us not forget that the “blessed subtraction” bus metaphor was shared at a pastoral training event. To think that those pastors didn’t imitate Driscoll would be to underestimate his legacy and influence.

We can certainly count that upcoming episodes will explore Driscoll’s new church in Arizona and its current conflicts. However, it is my hope that the podcast does the hard work of exploring the ongoing legacy of a church culture and leadership that are a reincarnation of Mars Hill. Instead of asking better questions, maybe the podcast will help us to begin to tell our stories. There can be no restoration without story.

Author’s Note- This article is a part of the “Medium Partner Program”. 100% of profits from this article will be used to support individuals in counseling, including family members, who have experienced spiritual abuse in the local church.

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Lydia Kulina

Educator and writer. Witty, gritty, and wise. Learner and doer.